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In South Korea, an Emphasis on Recycling Yields Results

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In South Korea, an Emphasis on Recycling Yields Results

HWASEONG, South Korea — At a sprawling recycling plant on this metropolis of farmland and business, the sound of sustainability is deafening.

The Recycling Administration Company plant, one of many nation’s nerve facilities of plastics recycling, runs across the clock, its maze of conveyor belts and sorters producing a din that would rival an airport runway.

But locations like this recycling plant helped South Korea attain the No. 10 spot on this yr’s “Inexperienced Future Index” report by the M.I.T. Expertise Overview. The World Financial Discussion board has cited the report on its web site, itemizing 10 nations which might be fashions for a greener future.

Whereas attendees collect on the World Financial Discussion board summit within the bucolic mountains of Switzerland this month, factories like these run by Recycling Administration are inclined to the each day grind of making a greener planet.

The factories assist South Korea meet formidable sustainability targets, that are bolstered with insurance policies, messaging and enforcement.

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South Korea, which is the dimensions of Portugal, however with a inhabitants of almost 52 million — whereas surrounded by water on three sides and a hostile neighbor to the north — is like a lot of the remainder of the planet: beneath strain to raised make the most of current assets, and to take action earlier than it’s too late.

That sense of urgency, and a United Nations effort to succeed in a global settlement by 2024 to eradicate plastic waste, might be on many minds on the Davos summit this yr because the ecological fallout from the pandemic turns into clear.

“One of many issues the pandemic revealed was an increase in the usage of plastic for meals deliveries and a way of security with further packaging everywhere in the world,” stated Kristin Hughes, the director of useful resource circularity on the World Financial Discussion board. “Recycling was placed on maintain in lots of nations. It wasn’t deemed as important.”

Now that the disaster section of the pandemic has handed, she stated, it’s time to modify route. “We have to transfer away from the take-use-dispose strategy,” she stated.

The problem of consumption and disposal is obvious throughout South Korea. A prepare experience by this nation reveals patches of crammed homes, companies and farms. There’s little room for landfills. In actual fact, one of many largest within the nation, which absorbs a lot of the waste from Seoul and its 10 million residents, is anticipated to be full by 2025.

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South Korea can be a serious producer, exporting electronics, vehicles and home equipment at breakneck velocity, which retains it hovering in or close to the highest 10 nations for G.D.P. This has created the necessity for factories and shipyards, in an already crowded nation that has scant room to accommodate them.

So recycling bins and meals waste canisters are ubiquitous, and 32-gallon food-recycling containers line the curbs of Seoul a lot the best way vehicles pack the roads within the capital’s infamous site visitors.

On the Recycling Administration manufacturing unit on a current afternoon, dozens of employees in protecting gear stood alongside jolting conveyor belts, sorting and positioning hundreds of plastic bottles and sending them on to their second or third life.

Searing temperatures in rattling equipment eliminated paper logos, then melted the plastic into small items referred to as PET, or polyethylene terephthalate, chips that have been then bundled into 1,540-pound luggage to be shipped world wide and repurposed into gadgets akin to bottles and artificial clothes. 2 hundred of those large luggage are produced each day (besides on Sundays, when the manufacturing unit is closed), accounting, together with a sister facility in close by Osan, for 19 p.c of South Korea’s whole PET bottles recycling output.

“We acquire, recycle and repurpose,” stated Im Sung-jin, the vice chairman of Recycling Administration. “However the larger image for me is that we do that as a result of we have now an obligation to the planet.”

That notion of duty was the main focus of the Inexperienced Future Index, the second annual rating of 76 economies “on their progress and dedication towards constructing a low-carbon future.” It additionally singled out 9 different nations for his or her efforts at targets like curbing fossil gasoline emissions, reaching carbon neutrality or rising electrical automotive gross sales.

South Korea was spotlighted particularly for recycling. Its waste administration system, referred to as jongnyangje, requires meals, rubbish, recyclables and hulking gadgets to be separated into color-coded luggage. The coverage is strict, and there are each penalties for noncompliance (as much as 1,000,000 Korean received, or about $785) and rewards for many who report violators (as much as $235).

“We have a look at what a rustic has carried out but in addition what can be carried out, each precise and aspirational,” stated Ross O’Brien, who led the analysis and writing of the Inexperienced Future Index, in a telephone interview from his residence in Hong Kong. “For instance, no different nation has as many new inexperienced patents per billion-dollar G.D.P. than South Korea. Based mostly on that, we imagine South Korea is the most efficient inexperienced innovation economic system on the earth.”

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The report discovered that Singapore and South Korea have been “the world’s best-ranked recycling economies,” as they “routinely increase coverage applications to encourage higher waste administration.”

The emphasis has had an affect: The common Korean citizen now throws out about 1.02 kilograms of family waste each day, a couple of third of the quantity produced in 1991. Its recycling and composting fee is 60 p.c, one of many highest on the earth, in response to the World Financial institution.

By 2030, South Korea goals to scale back its plastic waste by 50 p.c and recycle 70 p.c of it. And a nationwide deposit-return coverage charging 300 Korean received (about 25 cents) for all disposable espresso cups and different single-use beverage containers — after which reimbursing upon return — takes impact June 10.

As for meals waste, the World Financial Discussion board lauded South Korea way back to 2019, declaring that the nation recycled 95 p.c of its meals waste then, up from 2 p.c in 1995. Dumping most meals into landfills was banned in South Korea in 2005, and obligatory meals waste recycling was launched in 2013 at a value of about $6 a month for biodegradable luggage.

“This induced the general public to be extra lively in waste separation since they needed to pay for waste luggage in proportion to their disposal,” stated Kim Jong-min, the deputy director of the waste-to-energy division of the Ministry of Surroundings. “Earlier than implementing the coverage, meals waste clearly created a foul odor and spawned a large amount of leachate in landfills.”

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But the strategy to recycling has been shifting right here and in different nations in order that it’s now not considered as solely a shopper duty, in response to M.I.T.’s findings, which have been echoed by different environmental teams monitoring Asia.

One instance is South Korea’s E.P.R. (prolonged producer duty) system for packaging, which started in 2003. The Korea Packaging Recycling Cooperative, a nongovernment company, displays and expenses charges to hundreds of producers.

“Underneath the E.P.R. scheme, it’s all concerning the design of the merchandise, as charges that the producers pay differ,” stated Ma Jae Jeong, the director of the useful resource recycling division on the South Korea Ministry of Surroundings. “The extra recyclable the merchandise are, the much less the price. The producer will pay a price as much as 50 p.c much less for merchandise which have the best recyclable ranking. This provides firms huge incentive to provide extra recyclable merchandise.”

Nonetheless, South Korea has fallen quick in different areas, akin to electrical energy manufacturing.

“What the M.I.T. report highlights is nice as a result of South Koreans have a excessive stage of consciousness about local weather change, and we don’t have two opposing political sides, akin to within the U.S., arguing about its actuality,” stated Kim Joojin, the managing director and founding father of Options for Our Local weather, a Seoul-based advocacy group. “However, on the identical time, South Korea is saddled with an antiquated energy sector and is lagging different much less rich nations. That is usually at odds with its world picture as a frontrunner in so-called inexperienced expertise.”

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On the World Financial Discussion board, one session will deal with plastics air pollution, following up on a U.N. Surroundings Meeting assembly in Nairobi, Kenya, in March by which 175 nations, together with South Korea, agreed to think about a binding decision to eradicate plastic waste air pollution on the finish of 2024. The hope, Ms. Hughes stated, is that Davos will highlight the pressing want to provide sustainable practices worldwide.

“It’s this complete concept of ‘take, use, reuse, refill, recycle,’ and the way we hold utilizing and reusing,” she stated. “We’re wanting increasingly more at useful resource circularity. We’re not simply chucking all of it into the landfill any extra.”

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How Poshmark Is Trying to Make Resale Work Again

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How Poshmark Is Trying to Make Resale Work Again

Lauren Eager got into thrifting in high school. It was a way to find cheap, interesting clothes while not contributing to the wastefulness of fast fashion.

In 2015, in her first year of college, she downloaded the app for Poshmark, a kind of Instagram-meets-eBay resale platform. Soon, she was selling as well as buying clothes.

This was the golden age of online reselling. In addition to Poshmark, companies like ThredUp and Depop had sprung up, giving a second life to old clothes. In 2016, Facebook debuted Marketplace. Even Goodwill got into the action, starting a snazzy website.

The platforms tapped into two consumer trends: buying stuff online and the never-gets-old delight of snagging a gently used item for a fraction of the original cost. During the Covid-19 pandemic, as people cleaned out their closets, enthusiasm for reselling intensified. It was so strong that Poshmark decided to go public. On the day of its initial public offering in January 2021, the company’s market value peaked at $7.4 billion, roughly the same as PVH’s, the company that owns Calvin Klein and Tommy Hilfiger, at the time.

Then, the business of old clothes started to fray.

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Using the Poshmark app, Ms. Eager and others said, started to feel like trying to find something in a messy closet. The app was cluttered with features that did not work or that she did not use, and it felt “spammy,” she said, sending too many push notifications.

Many platforms found selling used items hard to scale. Now, online resellers are trying to recalibrate. Last year, ThredUp decided to exit Europe and focus on selling in the United States. Trove, a company that helps brands like Canada Goose and Steve Madden resell their goods, purchased a competitor, Recurate. The RealReal, a luxury consignor, appointed a new chief executive as the company tried to improve profitability.

Poshmark is undergoing perhaps the biggest reinvention. In 2023, Naver, South Korea’s biggest search engine as well as an online marketplace, bought the company in a deal valued at $1.6 billion, less than half its IPO price.

Something of a mash-up of Google and Amazon, Naver is betting it can rebuild Poshmark, which has 130 million active users, with the same technology that made Naver dominant in its own country.

It may also help breathe new life into the resale market. Analysts think the resale fashion market still has room to grow in the United States, with revenue expected to increase 26 percent to $36.3 billion by 2028, according to the retail consultancy firm Coresight Research.

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New legislation in California could help. The law, passed last year, requires brands and retailers that operate in the state and generate at least $1 million to set up a “producer responsibility organization” to collect and then reuse, repair or recycle its products. Resale platforms like ThredUp and Poshmark could be in a position to help brands carry out that mandate.

At the moment, though, Naver’s focus for Poshmark is more basic: Make it a better place to sell and shop. The company has the “operating know-how” to do that, said Philip Lee, a founder of the media outlet The Pickool, which covers both South Korean and U.S. tech companies.

“They’re trying to renovate Poshmark and then expand the market share,” he said.

Poshmark, which is based in Redwood City, Calif., was founded in 2011 by Manish Chandra, an entrepreneur and former tech executive, and three others. In trying to expand, Poshmark faced a problem common to resellers: Capturing the excitement of the secondhand-shopping treasure hunt while not frustrating buyers with an endless scroll. The company knew it needed better search, as well as interactive elements that gave people more reasons to come beyond paying $19 for a J. Crew sweater.

For its part, Naver was looking for ways to push beyond South Korea, where its commerce and search businesses were already mature. The growing online resale market in the United States presented an opportunity, and also gave the company access to the largest consumer market in the world.

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Commerce is a big growth engine for us,” Namsun Kim, Naver’s chief financial officer, said. And the peer-to-peer sector, where users sell to one another, was still in its infancy, with room to expand. But, Mr. Kim added, “it’s a more challenging segment, and that’s why it’s harder for a lot of the larger players to enter.”

There are two common business models for resale: peer-to-peer and consignment. With consignment, a platform collects and redistributes physical goods. Poshmark uses the peer-to-peer model, which relies on scores of people — many of them novices — haggling over prices and then mailing items to one another. This decentralization can be a headache for brands, which like to maintain a certain level of control of their products. And platforms like Poshmark must make buyers comfortable with trusting the sellers on their site.

Before the Naver purchase, it was difficult to push through needed technological changes, said Vanessa Wong, the vice president of product at Poshmark.

“I would always talk to my engineers and ask, ‘What if we do this or do that?’ They’re like, ‘That’s hard. The effort’s really high,’” Ms. Wong said.

Naver’s purchase offered both the investment and the expertise to pull off the changes. Founded in 1999, the company is everywhere in South Korea.

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“We are not just a simple search technology or A.I. service,” said Soo-yeon Choi, the chief executive of Naver, whose headquarters are near Seoul. The company, she said, “alleviates the frustrations of people, which is what is needed to help growth.”

Search built Naver “into the massive power that they are in Korea,” said Mr. Chandra, who stayed on as chief executive after Naver’s purchase. It was the top priority when the company bought Poshmark.

Several new elements for users and sellers have been introduced. With a tool called Posh Lens, users can take a photo of an item and, using Naver’s machine-learning technology, the site populates listings that are the same or similar to the shoe or tank top that they’re searching for. A paid ad feature for sellers called “Promoted Closet,” pushes listings higher on customer feeds.

Poshmark also introduced live shows, some of which are themed, to draw in the TikTok generation and increase engagement. One party auctioned off clothing previously worn by South Korean celebrities, a connection that was made with the help of Naver.

Still, the resale market is going through growing pains and has not quite found its footing since the height of the pandemic. It’s not clear whether the changes taking place at Poshmark will be enough. In May, Mr. Kim, Naver’s finance chief, said in an earnings call that Poshmark’s profitability was improving, but by November, the company was cautioning that growth had slowed because of weakness in the peer-to-peer resale market in North America.

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The company has already done some backpedaling on unpopular decisions.

In October, Poshmark introduced a new fee structure, which increased costs for buyers. Sellers, fearing that higher costs would make consumers bolt, revolted. Within weeks, the company scrapped the new fee structure.

And there are still user headaches: tags and keywords that help users find what they’re looking for can be miscategorized. Sellers sometimes tag their products incorrectly to get more eyeballs on their less popular products. (Hard-to-offload Amazon leggings, for example, may be listed as Free People apparel.)

The company is beta testing changes with its frequent sellers — people like Alex Mahl, who sells thousands of dollars in apparel on the site each year. And within dedicated Facebook groups related to Poshmark, there’s a lot of chatter about the changes that sellers and buyers would still like to see.

“The only way for it to do well is there’s going to be constant changes,” Ms. Mahl said about the tweaks on Poshmark. “If you were just on an app that never changed — one, it would be boring, and two, the opportunity to just do better wouldn’t be there.”

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One recent morning, Ms. Eager, the seller who joined Poshmark back in college, was pleasantly surprised to find that the app had some new features she actually liked. She snapped a photo of her Aerie gray tank top with Posh Lens. Within seconds, the app populated listings of similar products. It was so much better than conjuring up the adjectives needed to describe it.

“Love it,” Ms. Eager exclaimed.

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When receipts of home renovations are lost, is the tax break gone too?

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When receipts of home renovations are lost, is the tax break gone too?

Dear Liz: I have sold my family home recently after almost 50 years. I had done lots of improvements throughout those years. Due to a fire 15 years ago, all the documentation for these improvements has been destroyed. How do I document the improvements for the capital gains tax calculation?

Answer: As you probably know, you can exclude $250,000 of capital gains from the sale of a principal residence as long as you own and live in the home at least two of the previous five years. The exclusion is $500,000 for a couple.

Once upon a time, that meant few homeowners had to worry about capital gains taxes on the sale of their home. But the exclusion amounts haven’t changed since they were created in 1997, even as home values have soared. Qualifying home improvements can be used to increase your tax basis in the home and thus decrease your tax bill, but the IRS probably will demand proof of those changes should you be audited.

You could ask any contractors you used who are still in business if they will provide written verification of the work they performed, suggests Mark Luscombe, principal analyst for Wolters Kluwer Tax & Accounting. You also could check your home’s history with your property tax assessor to see if its assessment was adjusted to reflect any of the improvements.

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At a minimum, prepare a list from memory of the improvements you made, including the year and the approximate cost. If you don’t have pictures of the house reflecting the changes, perhaps friends and relatives might. This won’t be the best evidence, Luscombe concedes, but it might get the IRS to accept at least some increase in your tax basis.

If you’re a widow or widower, there’s another tax break you should know about. At least part of your home would have gotten a step-up in tax basis if you were married and your co-owner spouse died. In most states, the half owned by the deceased spouse would get a new tax basis reflecting the home’s current market value. In community property states such as California, both halves of the house get this step-up. A tax pro can provide more details.

Other homeowners should take note of the importance of keeping good digital records. While documents may not be lost in a fire, they may be misplaced, accidentally discarded or (in the case of receipts) so faded they’re illegible. To make sure documents are available when you need them, consider scanning or taking photographs of your records and keeping multiple copies, such as one set in your computer and another in a secure cloud account.

When an employee is misclassified as contractor

Dear Liz: A parent recently wrote to you about a son who was being paid as a contractor. I know someone else who got a job that did not “take out taxes from his paycheck.” Such workers believe they are pocketing more money, but unfortunately, too many do not know about the nature of withholding. They only learn if they choose to file for their expected refund, but instead discover an exorbitant tax liability that a paycheck-to-paycheck worker cannot pay.

The sad fact is that many of these employers improperly classify their workers, who are truly employees, as independent contractors! And they do this to avoid paying their own portion of Social Security and unemployment taxes and also workers compensation insurance.

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If workers believe that they have been misclassified (the IRS website provides all criteria), they can file IRS Form SS-8 and Form 8919, which will allow them to pay only their allocated half of their Social Security taxes. Hopefully the IRS will then contact these employers to correct their wrong classifications. And finally, it should be a law that, when hired, all true independent contractors should be given a clear form (not fine print on their employment agreements) that informs them of their status and the need to make estimated tax payments.

Answer: A big factor in determining whether a worker is an employee or contractor is control. Who controls what the worker does and how the worker does the job? The more control that’s in the employer’s hands, the more likely the worker is an employee.

However, the IRS notes that there are no hard and fast rules and that “factors which are relevant in one situation may not be relevant in another.”

The form you mentioned, IRS Form SS-8, also can be filed by any employer unsure if a worker is properly classified.

Liz Weston, Certified Financial Planner®, is a personal finance columnist. Questions may be sent to her at 3940 Laurel Canyon, No. 238, Studio City, CA 91604, or by using the “Contact” form at asklizweston.com.

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Inside Elon Musk’s Plan for DOGE to Slash Government Costs

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Inside Elon Musk’s Plan for DOGE to Slash Government Costs

An unpaid group of billionaires, tech executives and some disciples of Peter Thiel, a powerful Republican donor, are preparing to take up unofficial positions in the U.S. government in the name of cost-cutting.

As President-elect Donald J. Trump’s so-called Department of Government Efficiency girds for battle against “wasteful” spending, it is preparing to dispatch individuals with ties to its co-leaders, Elon Musk and Vivek Ramaswamy, to agencies across the federal government.

After Inauguration Day, the group of Silicon Valley-inflected, wide-eyed recruits will be deployed to Washington’s alphabet soup of agencies. The goal is for most major agencies to eventually have two DOGE representatives as they seek to cut costs like Mr. Musk did at X, his social media platform.

This story is based on interviews with roughly a dozen people who have insight into DOGE’s operations. They spoke to The Times on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak publicly.

On the eve of Mr. Trump’s presidency, the structure of DOGE is still amorphous and closely held. People involved in the operation say that secrecy and avoiding leaks is paramount, and much of its communication is conducted on Signal, the encrypted messaging app.

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Mr. Trump has said the effort would drive “drastic change,” and that the entity would provide outside advice on how to cut wasteful spending. DOGE itself will have no power to cut spending — that authority rests with Congress. Instead, it is expected to provide recommendations for programs and other areas to cut.

But parts of the operation are becoming clear: Many of the executives involved are expecting to do six-month voluntary stints inside the federal government before returning to their high-paying jobs. Mr. Musk has said they will not be paid — a nonstarter for some originally interested tech executives — and have been asked by him to work 80-hour weeks. Some, including possibly Mr. Musk, will be so-called special government employees, a specific category of temporary workers who can only work for the federal government for 130 days or less in a 365-day period.

The representatives will largely be stationed inside federal agencies. After some consideration by top officials, DOGE itself is now unlikely to incorporate as an organized outside entity or nonprofit. Instead, it is likely to exist as more of a brand for an interlinked group of aspirational leaders who are on joint group chats and share a loyalty to Mr. Musk or Mr. Ramaswamy.

“The cynics among us will say, ‘Oh, it’s naïve billionaires stepping into the fray.’ But the other side will say this is a service to the nation that we saw more typically around the founding of the nation,” said Trevor Traina, an entrepreneur who worked in the first Trump administration with associates who have considered joining DOGE.

“The friends I know have huge lives,” Mr. Traina said, “and they’re agreeing to work for free for six months, and leave their families and roll up their sleeves in an attempt to really turn things around. You can view it either way.”

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DOGE leaders have told others that the minority of people not detailed to agencies would be housed within the Executive Office of the President at the U.S. Digital Service, which was created in 2014 by former President Barack Obama to “change our government’s approach to technology.”

DOGE is also expected to have an office in the Office of Management and Budget, and officials have also considered forming a think tank outside the government in the future.

Mr. Musk’s friends have been intimately involved in choosing people who are set to be deployed to various agencies. Those who have conducted interviews for DOGE include the Silicon Valley investors Marc Andreessen, Shaun Maguire, Baris Akis and others who have a personal connection to Mr. Musk. Some who have received the Thiel Fellowship, a prestigious grant funded by Mr. Thiel given to those who promise to skip or drop out of college to become entrepreneurs, are involved with programming and operations for DOGE. Brokering an introduction to Mr. Musk or Mr. Ramaswamy, or their inner circles, has been a key way for leaders to be picked for deployment.

That is how the co-founder of Loom, Vinay Hiremath, said he became involved in DOGE in a rare public statement from someone who worked with the entity. In a post this month on his personal blog, Mr. Hiremath described the work that DOGE employees have been doing before he decided against moving to Washington to join the entity.

“After 8 calls with people who all talked fast and sounded very smart, I was added to a number of Signal groups and immediately put to work,” he wrote. “The next 4 weeks of my life consisted of 100s of calls recruiting the smartest people I’ve ever talked to, working on various projects I’m definitely not able to talk about, and learning how completely dysfunctional the government was. It was a blast.”

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These recruits are assigned to specific agencies where they are thought to have expertise. Some other DOGE enrollees have come to the attention of Mr. Musk and Mr. Ramaswamy through X. In recent weeks, DOGE’s account on X has posted requests to recruit a “very small number” of full-time salaried positions for engineers and back-office functions like human resources.

The DOGE team, including those paid engineers, is largely working out of a glass building in SpaceX’s downtown office located a few blocks from the White House. Some people close to Mr. Ramaswamy and Mr. Musk hope that these DOGE engineers can use artificial intelligence to find cost-cutting opportunities.

The broader effort is being run by two people with starkly different backgrounds: One is Brad Smith, a health care entrepreneur and former top health official in Mr. Trump’s first White House who is close with Jared Kushner, Mr. Trump’s son-in-law. Mr. Smith has effectively been running DOGE during the transition period, with a particular focus on recruiting, especially for the workers who will be embedded at the agencies.

Mr. Smith has been working closely with Steve Davis, a collaborator of Mr. Musk’s for two decades who is widely seen as working as Mr. Musk’s proxy on all things. Mr. Davis has joined Mr. Musk as he calls experts with questions about the federal budget, for instance.

Other people involved include Matt Luby, Mr. Ramaswamy’s chief of staff and childhood friend; Joanna Wischer, a Trump campaign official; and Rachel Riley, a McKinsey partner who works closely with Mr. Smith.

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Mr. Musk’s personal counsel — Chris Gober — and Mr. Ramaswamy’s personal lawyer — Steve Roberts — have been exploring various legal issues regarding the structure of DOGE. James Burnham, a former Justice Department official, is also helping DOGE with legal matters. Bill McGinley, Mr. Trump’s initial pick for White House counsel who was instead named as legal counsel for DOGE, has played a more minimal role.

“DOGE will be a cornerstone of the new administration, helping President Trump deliver his vision of a new golden era,” said James Fishback, the founder of Azoria, an investment firm, and confidant of Mr. Ramaswamy who will be providing outside advice for DOGE.

Despite all this firepower, many budget experts have been deeply skeptical about the effort and its cost-cutting ambitions. Mr. Musk initially said the effort could result in “at least $2 trillion” in cuts from the $6.75 trillion federal budget. But budget experts say that goal would be difficult to achieve without slashing popular programs like Social Security and Medicare, which Mr. Trump has promised not to cut.

Both Mr. Musk and Mr. Ramaswamy have also recast what success might mean. Mr. Ramaswamy emphasized DOGE-led deregulation on X last month, saying that removing regulations could stimulate the economy and that “the success of DOGE can’t be measured through deficit reduction alone.”

And in an interview last week with Mark Penn, the chairman and chief executive of Stagwell, a marketing company, Mr. Musk downplayed the total potential savings.

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“We’ll try for $2 trillion — I think that’s like the best-case outcome,” Mr. Musk said. “You kind of have to have some overage. I think if we try for two trillion, we’ve got a good shot at getting one.”

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