Lifestyle
Billie Eilish thought she'd always have a soft voice. Singing lessons changed that
Billie Eilish performs onstage during in New York City in May 2024.
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When Billie Eilish first hit the music scene as a teenager, she captivated audiences with her soft, whispery voice. Her 2019 debut album, When We All Fall Asleep, Where Do We Go?, which was produced by her brother, Finneas O’Connell, won Grammys for best record, album, song and new artist.
Billie assumed that would be the voice she’d sing with for years to come: “I thought it was going to be soft, and my range wasn’t going to be very big, and I wasn’t ever going to be able to belt, and I wasn’t ever going to be able to have much of a chest mix in my voice,” she says.
Then, two years ago, Billie began working with a music teacher, which she hadn’t done since she was a kid in the choir.
“It has honestly changed my life,” she says of the lessons. “My voice has just gotten 10 times better in the last two years. … I didn’t really know before I started working with a teacher again that you can always get better and you can train.”
Billie and Finneas have been writing songs and recording together since she was 13, and he was 18. At the time, both were being homeschooled, and songwriting was part of the curriculum.
“Our mom had us go home and watch something on TV or read something and just write down any interesting words that we see, or an interesting sentence and then … try to make a song out of what [we] wrote,” Billie says.
For Finneas, making music with his younger sister meant he always had a “guinea pig” available: “I was an amateur producer trying my best to record anyone. Billie, as a 13 year old who’d basically never sung into a microphone at all, obliged. And it was kind of a good match,” he says.
Finneas produces his own music, and he also produced and co-wrote the songs on Billie’s latest album, Hit Me Hard and Soft, which is up for six Grammys. Nearly a decade into their collaboration, with seven top-10 hits, several Grammys and two Oscars, Billie and Finneas are still partners, finding new ways of pushing and supporting each other.
Interview highlights
On writing music for his teen sister instead of for his band
Finneas: Billie and I’ve always gotten along great. I’m sure being homeschooled impacted that because we had a relationship that might have been more three dimensional than if we were in separate grades and saw each other a little bit on the weekend. … We spent a lot of time together having nuanced conversations. That’s part number one in terms of wanting to spend time with her.
Number two is she had a really beautiful voice. And so I think even in addition to liking her as a presence in my life, I saw her talent and respected her talent.
On finding comfort in her teenage fanbase because of how isolating fame was as a teen
Billie: When I became famous-ish at 14, it was not a good time in terms of keeping friendships. I think when you’re 14, that’s kind of an age where friendships are already kind of rocky. And also all my friends did go to school, so they were all going to high school and your relationships are kind of already rocky right then. And suddenly I had no way of relating to anyone. And I kind of lost all my friends. I maintained a couple, but those were really challenging to keep even still. And so for those few years of becoming this enormous superstar, I was kind of feeling like, “Wait, what the hell is the point? I don’t have any friends and I’m losing all the things that I love so deeply and all the people that I love.” And so, in a way, the fans kind of saved me, because they were my age and I felt like they were the only kind of friends I had for a while.
On having a teen audience as Billie’s older brother
Finneas: I’m four years older, so I would say that I didn’t have much of a kind of a feeling one way or the other about the age or gender of the predominant audience. I had a real sense of gratitude for their enthusiasm. And the audience that was coming to the shows that Billie was playing couldn’t have been more engaged and enthusiastic.
On modeling her stage presence more after male performers

Billie: I think a lot of women go through the feeling of just envying men in … one way or the other. And for me, I would watch videos of different male performers on stage and just feel this, like, deep sadness in my body that I’ll never be able to take my shirt off on stage and run around and like, not try very hard and just jump around on stage and that’s enough and have enough energy from just myself with no backup dancers and no huge stage production and the crowd will still love me. And only a man can do that.
And because of that, I think more than almost anything else in my career, I was very, very, very determined to kind of prove that thought wrong — and I really did. I really feel like I did. I didn’t like the kind of pop-girl leotard, backup dancers, hair done thing. I didn’t like that, for me. I liked it for other people, but that didn’t resonate with me. I never saw myself in those people. And honestly, I never saw myself in any women that I saw on stage, but I did see myself in the men that I saw on stage, and I thought that was unfair. And so I did everything that I could to kind of try to break that within myself and the industry. And I’m not saying I’m the only person that’s ever done that at all. But for me, that was really important.
On her baggy clothes being inspired by men in hip-hop
Billie: I would watch [hip-hop] videos and instead of being jealous of the women who get to be around the hot men, I would be jealous of the hot men. And I wanted to be them and I wanted to dress like them and I wanted to be able to act like them. And to be fair, I had all sorts of women that I looked up to and artists that are the reason that I am who I am. …
My favorite singers are all old jazz singers that I’ve always looked up to, and I’m always forcing people to watch videos of Ella Fitzgerald singing live and Julie London singing live. And Sarah Vaughan and Nancy Wilson and all these people. We were watching these videos and every single one, of course, because of that period of time, they’re all wearing dresses, they’re all wearing tight, corseted, maybe, dresses with their hair done. But … that’s part of how things were then. And so thank God that those women came before me because otherwise I wouldn’t have been able to do anything.
Finneas and Billie Eilish won the Best Original Song Oscar in 2024 for “What Was I Made For?,” from the film Barbie.
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On having family support
Finneas: I was making music with Billie in my bedroom and trying my best. And [Billie] was kind about it. She was like, “I like that.” She liked the songs I was writing. She liked “Ocean Eyes,” I think that I got so much positive reinforcement when I really needed it, you know?
When I find out people have had careers in the arts, when they were actively discouraged, and when you hear somebody say, “Man, my mom hated my voice,” or something like that, I’m always kind of blown away because to me, I had enough self-doubt and enough imposter syndrome that that if anyone had said, “You’re not very good,” I would have been like, “Correct. I agree.” Let me stop doing this now. And it really took people like Billie and people like my friend Frank to be like, “No, no, no, you’re better than you think you are,” to kind of give me the confidence that I needed.
On studying songwriting as a part of their homeschooling

Billie: Something that I think has always helped in songwriting, is giving yourself permission to write a bad song, because the more you do it, the better you get. … I think that sometimes you have this high expectation for yourself and you’re like, “No, no, no, it has to be really good.” But you can’t just sit down and make something perfect immediately every time you have to try and fail. And that was something that was really hard for me. I’m not good at patience and I’m not good at not being good at something until I am. I want to be really good immediately. Something that helped me a lot is just allowing myself to not be amazing and just make something to make it and not worry if it’s good.
On the validation that fans relate to her lyrics
Billie: My favorite is when we put a song out people are like, “How did she know I was feeling this? Where is she hiding in my room … to write this song that’s exactly my life?” I think that’s like one of the most magical parts about music. And I’ve had that as a fan, too. And Finneas has too. You hear a song and you’re like, “Oh my God, this is exactly my situation. How could that be?” But it’s just that it can be because we’re just all suffering together — and it’s nice to know that you’re not alone in that.
Thea Chaloner and Susan Nyakundi produced and edited this interview for broadcast. Bridget Bentz, Molly Seavy-Nesper and Jacob Ganz adapted it for the web.
Lifestyle
It Started with a Midnight Swim and a Kiss Under the Stars
When Marian Sherry Lurio and Jonathan Buffington Nguyen met at a mutual friend’s wedding at Higgins Lake, Mich., in July 2022, both felt an immediate chemistry. As the evening progressed, they sat on the shore of the lake in Adirondack chairs under the stars, where they had their first kiss before joining others for a midnight plunge.
The two learned that the following weekend Ms. Lurio planned to attend a wedding in Philadelphia, where Mr. Nguyen lives, and before they had even exchanged numbers, they already had a first date on the books.
“I have a vivid memory of after we first met,” Mr. Nguyen said, “just feeling like I really better not screw this up.”
Before long, they were commuting between Philadelphia and New York City, where Ms. Lurio lives, spending weekends and the odd remote work days in one another’s apartments in Philadelphia and Manhattan. Within the first six months of dating, Mr. Nguyen joined Ms. Lurio’s family for Thanksgiving in Villanova, Pa., and, the following month, she met his family in Beavercreek, Ohio, at a surprise birthday party for Mr. Nguyen’s mother.
Ms. Lurio, 32, who grew up in Merion Station outside Philadelphia, works in investor relations administration at Flexpoint Ford, a private equity firm. She graduated from Dartmouth College with a bachelor’s degree in history and psychology.
Mr. Nguyen, also 32, was born in Knoxville, Tenn., and raised in Beavercreek, Ohio, from the age of 7. He graduated from Haverford College with a bachelor’s degree in political science and is now a director at Doyle Real Estate Advisors in Philadelphia.
Their long-distance relationship continued for the next few years. There were dates in Manhattan, vacations and beach trips to the Jersey Shore. They attended sporting events and discovered their shared appreciation of the 2003 film, “Love Actually.”
One evening, Mr. Nguyen recalled looking around Ms. Lurio’s small New York studio — strewed with clothes and the takeout meal they had ordered — and feeling “so comfortable and safe.” “I knew that this was something different than just sort of a fling,” he said.
It was an open question when they would move in together. In 2024, Ms. Lurio began the process of moving into Mr. Nguyen’s home in Philadelphia — even bringing her cat, Scott — but her plans changed midway when an opportunity arose to expand her role with her current employer.
Mr. Nguyen was on board with her decision. “It almost feels like stolen valor to call it ‘long distance,’ because it’s so easy from Philadelphia to New York,” Mr. Nguyen said. “The joke is, it’s easier to get to Philly from New York than to get to some parts of Brooklyn from Manhattan, right?”
In January 2025, Mr. Nguyen visited Ms. Lurio in New York with more up his sleeve than spending the weekend. Together they had discussed marriage and bespoke rings, but when Mr. Nguyen left Ms. Lurio and an unfinished cheese plate at the bar of the Chelsea Hotel that Friday evening, she had no idea what was coming next.
“I remember texting Jonathan,” Ms. Lurio said, bewildered: “‘You didn’t go toward the bathroom!’” When a Lobby Bar server came and asked her to come outside, Ms. Lurio still didn’t realize what was happening until she was standing in the hallway, where Mr. Nguyen stood recreating a key moment from the film “Love Actually,” in which one character silently professes his love for another in writing by flashing a series of cue cards. There, in the storied Chelsea Hotel hallway still festooned with Christmas decorations, Mr. Nguyen shared his last card that said, “Will you marry me?”
They wed on April 11 in front of 200 guests at the Pump House, a covered space on the banks of Philadelphia’s Schuylkill River. Mr. Nguyen’s sister, the Rev. Elizabeth Nguyen, who is ordained through the Unitarian Universalist Association, officiated.
Although formal attire was suggested, Ms. Lurio said that the ceremony was “pretty casual.” She and Jonathan got ready together, and their families served as their wedding parties.
“I said I wanted a five-minute wedding,” Ms. Lurio recalled, though the ceremony ended up lasting a little longer than that. During the ceremony, Ms. Nguyen read a homily and jokingly added that guests should not ask the bride and groom about their living arrangements, which will remain separate for the foreseeable future.
While watching Ms. Lurio walk down the aisle, flanked by her parents, Mr. Nguyen said he remembered feeling at once grounded in the moment and also a sense of dazed joy: “Like, is this real? I felt very lucky in that moment — and also just excited for the party to start!”
Lifestyle
L.A. Affairs: I loved someone who felt he couldn’t be fully seen with me
He always texted when he was outside. No call, no knock. It was just a message and then the soft sound of my door opening. He moved like someone practiced in disappearing.
His name meant “complete” in Arabic, which is what I felt when we were together.
I met him the way you meet most things that matter in Los Angeles — without intending to. In our senior year at a college in eastern L.A. County, we were introduced through mutual friends, then thrown together by the particular gravity of people who recognized something in each other. He was a Muslim medical student, conservative and careful and funny in the dry, precise way of someone who has always had to choose his words. I was loud where he was quiet, messy where he was disciplined. I was out. He was not.
I understood, or thought I did. I thought that I couldn’t get hurt if I was completely conscious throughout the endeavor. Los Angeles has a way of making you feel like the whole world shares your freedoms — until you realize the city is enormous, and not all of it belongs to you in the same way.
For months, our world was confined to my apartment. He would slip in after dark, and we’d stay up late talking about his family in Iran, classical music and the particular pressure of being the son someone sacrificed everything to bring here. He told me things he said he’d never told anyone, and I believed him.
The orange glow from my Nesso lamp lit his face while the indigo sky pressed against the window behind him. In our small little world, we were safe. Outside was another matter.
On our first real date, I took him to the L.A. Phil’s “An Evening of Film & Music: From Mexico to Hollywood” program. I told him they were cheap seats even though they were the first row on the terrace. He was thrilled in the way only someone who doesn’t expect to be delighted actually gets delighted — fully, without guarding it. I put my arm around his shoulders. At some point, I shifted and moved it, and he nudged it back. He was OK with PDA here.
I remember thinking that wealth is a great barrier to harm and then feeling silly for extrapolating my own experience once again. Inside Walt Disney Concert Hall, we were just two people in love with the same music.
Outside was still another matter.
In February, on Valentine’s Day, he took me to a Yemeni restaurant in Anaheim. We hovered over saffron tea surrounded by other young Southern Californians, and we looked like friends. Before we went in, we sat in the parking lot of the strip mall — signs in Arabic advertising bread, coffee, halal meats, the Little Arabia District — hand in hand. I leaned over to kiss him.
“Not here,” he said. His eyes shifted furtively. “Someone might see.”
I understood, or told myself I did, but I was saddened. Later, after the kind of reflection that only arrives in the wreckage, I would understand something harder: I had been unconsciously asking him to choose, over and over, between the people he loved and the person he loved. I had a long pattern of choosing unavailable men, telling myself it was because I could handle the complexity. The truth was more embarrassing. I thought that if someone like him chose me anyway — chose me over the weight of societal expectations — it would mean I was worth choosing. It took me a long time to see how unfair that was to him and to me.
We went to the Norton Simon Museum together in November, on the kind of gray Pasadena day when the 210 Freeway roars in the background like white noise. He studied for the MCAT while I wrote a paper on Persian rugs. In between practice problems, he translated ancient Arabic scripts for me. I thought, “We make a good team.” Afterward, we walked through the galleries and he didn’t let go of my arm.
That was the version of us I kept returning to — when the ending came during Ramadan. It arrived as a spiritual reflection of my own. I texted: “Does this end at graduation — whatever we are doing?”
He thought I meant Ramadan. I did not mean Ramadan.
“I care about you,” he wrote, “but I don’t want you to think this could work out to anything more than just dating. I mean, of course, I’ve fantasized about marrying you. If I could live my life the way I wanted, of course I would continue. I’m just sad it’s not in this lifetime.”
I was in Mexico City when these texts were exchanged. That night I flew to Oaxaca to clear my head and then, after less than 24 hours, flew back to L.A. No amount of vacation would allow me to process what had just happened, so I threw myself back into work.
My therapist told me to use the conjunction “and” instead of “but.” It happened, and I am changed. The harm I caused and the love I felt. The beauty of what we made and the impossibility of where it could go. She gave me a knowing smile when I asked if it would stay with me forever. She didn’t answer, which was the answer.
I think about the freeways now, the way Joan Didion called them our only secular communion. When you’re on the ground in Los Angeles, the world narrows to the few blocks around you. Get on the freeway and you understand the whole body of the city at once: the arteries, the pulse, the scale of the thing.
You understand that you are a single cell in something enormous and moving. It is all out of your control. I am in a lane. The lane shaped how I drive. He was simply in a different lane, and his lane shaped him, and those two facts can coexist without either of us being the villain of the sad story.
He came like a secret in the night, and he left the same way. What we made in between was real and complicated and mine to hold forever, hoping we find each other in the next life.
The author lives in Los Angeles.
L.A. Affairs chronicles the search for romantic love in all its glorious expressions in the L.A. area, and we want to hear your true story. We pay $400 for a published essay. Email LAAffairs@latimes.com. You can find submission guidelines here. You can find past columns here.
Lifestyle
The Nerve Center of This Art Fair Isn’t Painting. It’s Couture.
The art industry is increasingly shaped by artists’ and art businesses’ shared realization that they are locked in a fierce struggle for sustained attention — against each other, and against the rest of the overstimulated, always-online world. A major New York art fair aims to win this competition next month by knocking down the increasingly shaky walls between contemporary art and fashion.
When visitors enter the Independent art fair on May 14, they will almost immediately encounter its open-plan centerpiece: an installation of recent couture looks from Comme des Garçons. It will be the first New York solo presentation of works by Rei Kawakubo, the brand’s founder and mastermind, since a lauded 2017 survey exhibition at the Metropolitan Museum of Art’s Costume Institute.
Art fairs have often been front and center in the industry’s 21st-century quest to capture mindshare. But too many displays have pierced the zeitgeist with six-figure spectacles, like Maurizio Cattelan’s duct-taped banana and Beeple’s robot dogs. Curating Independent around Comme des Garçons comes from the conviction that a different kind of iconoclasm can rise to the top of New York’s spring art scrum.
Elizabeth Dee, the founder and creative director of Independent, said that making Kawakubo’s work the “nerve center” of this year’s edition was a “statement of purpose” for the fair’s evolution. After several years at the compact Spring Studios in TriBeCa, Independent will more than double its square footage by moving to Pier 36 at South Street, on the East River. Dee has narrowed the fair’s exhibitor list, to 76, from 83 dealers in 2025, and reduced booth fees to encourage a focus on single artists making bold propositions.
“Rei’s work has been pivotal to thinking about how my work as a curator, gallerist and art fair can push boundaries, especially during this extraordinary move toward corporatization and monoculture in the art world in the last 20 years,” Dee said.
Kawakubo’s designs have been challenging norms since her brand’s first Paris runway show in 1981, but her work over the last 13 years on what she calls “objects for the body” has blurred borders between high fashion and wearable sculpture.
The Comme des Garçons presentation at Independent will feature 20 looks from autumn-winter 2020 to spring-summer 2025. Forgoing the runway, Kawakubo is installing her non-clothing inside structures made from rebar and colored plastic joinery.
Adrian Joffe, the president of both Comme des Garçons International and the curated retailer Dover Street Market International (and who is also Kawakubo’s husband), said in an interview that Kawakubo’s intention was to create a sculptural installation divorced from chronology and fashion — “a thing made new again.”
Every look at Independent was made in an edition of three or fewer, but only one of each will be for sale on-site. Prices will be about $9,000 to $30,000. Comme des Garçons will retain 100 percent of the sales.
Asked why she was interested in exhibiting at Independent, the famously elusive Kawakubo said via email, “The body of work has never been shown together, and this is the first presentation in New York in almost 10 years.” Joffe added a broader philosophical motivation. “We’ve never done it before; it was new,” he said. Also essential was the fair’s willingness to embrace Kawakubo’s vision for the installation rather than a standard fair booth.
Kawakubo began consistently engaging with fine art decades before such crossovers became commonplace. Since 1989, she has invited a steady stream of contemporary artists to create installations in Comme des Garçons’s Tokyo flagship store. The ’90s brought collaborations with the artist Cindy Sherman and performance pioneer Merce Cunningham, among others.
More cross-disciplinary projects followed, including limited-release direct mailers for Comme des Garçons. Kawakubo designs each from documentation of works provided by an artist or art collective.
The display at Independent reopens the debate about Kawakubo’s proper place on the continuum between artist and designer. But the issue is already settled for celebrated artists who have collaborated with her.
“I totally think of Rei as an artist in the truest sense,” Sherman said by email. “Her work questions what everyone else takes for granted as being flattering to a body, questions what female bodies are expected to look like and who they’re catering to.”
Ai Weiwei, the subject of a 2010 Comme des Garçons direct mailer, agreed that Kawakubo “is, in essence, an artist.” Unlike designers who “pursue a sense of form,” he added, “her design and creation are oriented toward attitude” — specifically, an attitude of “rebellion.”
Also taking this position is “Costume Art,” the spring exhibition at the Costume Institute. Opening May 10, the show pairs individual works from multiple designers — including Comme des Garçons — with artworks from the Met’s holdings to advance the argument made by the dress code for this year’s Met gala: “Fashion is art.”
True to form, Kawakubo sometimes opts for a third way.
“Rei has often said she’s not a designer, she’s not an artist,” Joffe said. “She is a storyteller.”
Now to find out whether an art fair sparks the drama, dialogue and attention its authors want.
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