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What’s a book ban anyway? Depends on who you ask

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What’s a book ban anyway? Depends on who you ask

Librarian Sabrina Jesram arranges a display of books during Banned Books Week at a public library branch in New York City on Sept. 23, 2022.

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“Book ban” is one of those headline-ready terms often used by the news media, including NPR, for stories about the surge in book challenges across the U.S.

The American Library Association launched its annual Banned Books Week in 1982. There are banned book clubs. States have introduced or passed laws that’ve been called bans on book bans. Meanwhile, many people fighting to get books removed from school libraries are not fans of the term book ban.

The practice of censoring books has been around for centuries. But what does it actually mean to ban a book today? The answer depends on who you ask. Here are a handful of definitions from people entrenched in the issue:

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Kasey Meehan, program director of PEN America’s Freedom to Read (speaking at a video press conference in April) : “We define a book ban as any action taken against a book based on its content that leads to a previously accessible book being completely removed from availability for students or where access to a book is restricted or diminished. PEN is perhaps a bit unique, and that’s in contrast to ALA [American Library Association] and some others, in that we do include books that have been removed while awaiting review as a ban. We include that because we know books are undergoing review. As long as they are removed from access for students, those books can be removed for weeks, months, upwards of a year as we’ve seen in some cases.”

NOTE: The American Enterprise Institute took exception to PEN America’s definition. A study AEI conducted for the Educational Freedom Institute looked at PEN America’s 2021-2022 “index of banned books” and found that “74 percent of the books” listed as banned “are listed as available in the same districts from which PEN America says those books were banned.”

Emily Drabinski, president of the American Library Association: “A ‘book ban’ is the removal of a title from a library because someone considers it harmful or dangerous. A ‘challenge’ is when someone raises an objection to a library material or a program or a service. ‘Reconsideration’ is the formal process libraries go through to determine whether a book meets the library’s selection criteria. We reserve ‘book ban’ for… a book that meets that criteria when it has been removed from a collection entirely. … You often do find that books, they are challenged and then they undergo a review process and sometimes they end up being pulled and banned and other times they end up back on the shelves. I think sometimes our policymakers and many of the people who are active in the pro-censorship movement, they don’t fully appreciate or understand the fact that many Americans, lots of them, don’t have access to books in any other way except through their library, through their school or public or academic library.

Joe Tier, a self-described “concerned grandparent and parent living in Eldersburg, Maryland”: “I think [the term book ban is] designed to be inflammatory and to obfuscate the constructive dialogue that should occur about age appropriate content. It can be a dog whistle that’s used to incite anger against those who are opposed to limiting sexually explicit content in public school libraries. … You really cannot ban anything, you know, material-wise these days because you have the Internet and you have PDFs. And so the term book ban is almost obsolete.”

Mustafa Akyol, senior fellow at the Cato Institute and author of Islam Without Extremes (banned in Malaysia in 2017): “When [a book] is banned, it’s not available, so it’s not legal to sell it. That’s what a book ban means. … I was arrested at the Kuala Lumpur International Airport… After 18 hours of detainment by the Malaysian religion police, I was let go… Bookstores couldn’t sell [Islam Without Extremes] in Malaysia. My book was not available… There might be some regimes who are even going after people for possessing a copy of the book… I don’t think there are literal book bans in the United States. When a book is banned, literally the authority says this book is not legal. … Sometimes people use hyperbolic language to express their thoughts about a particular problem, and that might be a problem. And that divisive rhetoric then makes everything worse. So you cannot reasonably agree on some reasonable common ground and everybody becomes more and more strident and angry against each other. That in itself becomes a major problem for a democracy rather than just different opinion that people have on certain things.”

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Mona Kerby, Master’s degree in School Librarianship coordinator at McDaniel College in Westminster, Maryland: “To me, ‘banned’ is the book’s not on the shelf. But I could certainly see the different flavors of that word, and that’s why a discussion about ideas is always so enriching. …The few times I had some question about materials, those moments turned into wonderful opportunities between me and the parent just to discuss. And we both learned. So respecting one another’s opinion and listening to another’s opinion is not a bad skill to have.”

This story was edited for radio and digital by Meghan Collins Sullivan.

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Trump relished in being compared to dictators like Hitler and Stalin, journalist says

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Trump relished in being compared to dictators like Hitler and Stalin, journalist says

A gold-colored item embossed with the word “President” sits on the Resolute desk in the Oval Office of the White House on Nov. 10, 2025.

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The New York Times journalist Jonathan Swan has spent the past 11 years covering President Trump through three political campaigns, his first, and now second, term in office and the ongoing war with Iran. Swan says aside from the COVID-19 pandemic, he can’t remember a time where Trump looked “as stuck as he looks right now.”

“It’s pretty clear he realizes that this war [with Iran] has not gone well, has not played out the way that Netanyahu pitched him or that Trump himself thought [it] would play out,” Swan says. “Trump is someone who is naturally given to hubris, but I think we saw a very extreme version of that with this war.”

Swan and his co-author Maggie Haberman spoke with more than 1,000 sources for their new book, Regime Change: Inside the Imperial Presidency of Donald Trump. The book paints a picture of an unrestrained president remaking the American government and its international relations in profound ways.

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Swan notes that the president, who sat for an interview for the book, has been particularly fixated on becoming a “great man of history” during his second term. During one interview, Trump showed Swan and Haberman a document that compared him to notorious historical figures like Mao, Stalin, Hitler, Attila the Hun and Genghis Khan.

“[The list had] nothing to do with morality, all just about pure power projection. And Trump was relishing being in their company,” Swan says. “Maggie and I talked about it afterwards, and it really occurred to us that when you look at it through that lens, his second term makes a lot more sense.”

Swan says the president’s fixation on power is reflected in his decisions to go to war in Iran and implement regime change in Venezuela. But he also sees it manifested in Trump’s White House decor, which leans on what Swan calls the president’s “inner Louis XIV” style.

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Homelessness is more common than you think. : It’s Been a Minute

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Homelessness is more common than you think. : It’s Been a Minute

The real spectrum of housing insecurity

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Annika McFarlane/Getty Images/Getty Images

Who counts as homeless in America?

If you ask the Department of Housing and Urban Development, around 750,000 people are homeless in America. If you ask the Department of Education, that number shoots up into the millions. What does this discrepancy tell us?  And how do our cultural ideas about homelessness shape who we see as homeless, and who gets help? To find out, Brittany talks with Dr. Margot Kushel, Director at the UCSF Benioff Homelessness and Housing Initiative, and Dr. Molly Richard, assistant professor in the Department of Public Health at the University of Rhode Island’s College of Health Sciences.

Want more deep dives on cultural taboos?  Check out these episodes:
The truth about men on the ‘down low’
Why can’t we be normal about polyamory?

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Follow Brittany on Instagram: @bmluse

For handpicked podcast recommendations every week, subscribe to NPR’s Pod Club newsletter at npr.org/podclub.

This episode was produced by Corey Antonio Rose. It was edited by Neena Pathak. We had engineering support from Josephine Nyounai. Our Supervising Producer is Cher Vincent. Our Executive Producer is Barton Girdwood. Our VP of Programming is Yolanda Sangweni.

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They just completed all of L.A. Times’ 101 Best California Experiences — and we’ve got questions!

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They just completed all of L.A. Times’ 101 Best California Experiences — and we’ve got questions!

By December of 2023, Paul Preston realized that his girlfriend Susan Huckle was a big fan of road trips and lists. So for Christmas, he gave her L.A. Times’ ”101 Best California Experiences” zine, a traveler’s bucket list highlighting my top destinations throughout my four decades of traveling the state.

The gift, I’m delighted to hear, was a hit.

Preston and Huckle went through it and checked off locations they’d seen already. Then they hit the road.

And now, after two and a half years of roaming the state between work assignments, they’re back to report that they’ve covered all 101 locations on that list. Though the two have also traveled beyond state lines, the quest to cover California “totally informed our lives for the last two or three years,” said Huckle, who sent me a note of thanks after ticking the last box.

After the note arrived, I was eager to call them and learn more. I caught the couple, of course, in the middle of a day trip.

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Susan Huckle and Paul Preston set out to visit every spot on the L.A. Times’ 2023 list of “101 Best California Experiences.” Along the way, they got married in Yosemite Valley.

(Nick Wuthrich)

“We’re out exploring,” Preston said. “So you’re getting what we’re about.”

They’re also now married. That happened last July in Yosemite Valley, which, yes, was on the list.

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Huckle, 41, an actress, a host on “L.A. This Week” on Channel 35, a Universal Studios performer and an author, grew up in Santa Maria on California’s Central Coast.

Preston, 56, is also an actor. He leads movie location tours and hosts podcasts, movie trivia nights and special events. He grew up and went to college on the East Coast, so he had fewer California miles under his belt when the couple met in 2020.

Their California 101 travels began in early 2024 with a trip to Paso Robles, where they saw the green slopes along Highway 46, Morro Rock and the elephant seals at Piedras Blancas near Hearst Castle.

“And then,” Preston said, “we just kept going.”

Some of their most satisfying stops, the two agreed, were places they hadn’t heard of, such as Orange Works in the Central Valley town of Strathmore and Angel Island State Park, sometimes known as the Ellis Island of the West. Huckle called Angel Island “a marriage of natural beauty with great, powerful, historic information.”

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By early this year, there were only a few destinations left to check.

In April, they did the Indian Canyons and Sunnylands estate near Palm Springs, the Integratron near Joshua Tree and the Cheech Marin Center for Chicano Art & Culture in Riverside. In June, they rafted the South Fork of the American River, along with stops in Old Sacramento and, last of all, Columbia State Historic Park. Then they made their own favorites lists.

Susan Huckle’s top 10:

Yosemite Valley
Badwater Basin
Mammoth Mountain
Angel Island State Park
Cheech Marin Center
Joshua Tree National Park
American River South Fork
The Marshall Store on Tomales Bay
Santa Cruz Island
Sunnylands

Paul Preston’s top 10:

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Yosemite Valley
Hollywood Bowl
Griffith Observatory
Catalina
Mammoth Mountain
American River South Fork
Erick Schats’ Bakery in Bishop
Huntington Library and Gardens
Palm Springs Aerial Tramway
Balboa Park, San Diego

Now that they’ve seen so much of the state, I had questions. For one, which spots not on the list would they have included?

Alcatraz, they agreed. Also, as an admirer of redwoods, Preston liked Calaveras Big Trees State Park. As an avid cyclist, Huckle liked the 22-mile Marvin Braude Bike Trail from Torrance to Pacific Palisades.

And was anything on the list a disappointment?

“The Carmel Mission,” Huckle said quickly. “It’s beautiful and the missions are an important part of California history.” But she said the mission’s account of its own history seemed “whitewashed,” saying little about the Native loss and trauma that historians are increasingly recognizing in accounts of the missions.

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Said Huckle: “I was like, ‘C’mon guys, nobody really thinks this any more, right?’”

Now that they’re done with the Times’ “101 Best California Experiences,” what what will shape their next trips?

They have a list for that. Huckle picked up an L.A. guide, Danny Jensen’s “Secret Los Angeles,” and the couple plans to start where the book does, with the Triforium, a many-colored sculpture that went up outside City Hall in 1975 (and once featured music).

After that? Maybe the Faces of Elysian Valley, a traffic circle sculpture that Huckle said “looks like Easter Island in the middle of Cypress Park.”

That will leave only about 138 more destinations in the book to cover.

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If anybody can do it, it’s these two.

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