What if California seceded from the United States? – Downside Up – Podcast on CNN Audio

You have in all probability seen the flashy tourism advertisements for California, glamorous film stars, tech moguls and celebrities snowboarding down snow lined mountains or browsing waves at sundown, beckoning the remainder of the world to come back to the Golden State. For hundreds of years, folks have been fascinated with the West, chasing gold or journey or escaping lives they’ve left behind, and California as this West as you may get the contiguous United States. Ever because it joined the Union in 1850 California has been a vacation spot for dreamers and doers drawn by Hollywood, Silicon Valley, the state’s pure magnificence and a way of limitless chance. California is the place Walt Disney constructed his fantasyland and the place George Lucas took us to a galaxy far, distant. It is no marvel that one other California tourism marketing campaign known as the state the land of what ifs.

Right here in California, we imagine in what if. In any case, if is our center identify. Right here we welcome all “what ifs?” with open arms.

However not too long ago a darker what if query has began to take maintain. What if California seceded from the US?

Welcome again to Draw back Up, a podcast from CNN exploring shocking and unusual What If questions. I am Chris Cillizza and as we speak we’re grappling with the query “what if one of many greatest, strongest states within the nation determined it was time to simply depart the union?” May an unbiased California make it by itself? What would the remainder of the US be like if California left? And is secession even authorized? Be part of us as we flip the American experiment draw back up.

When most of us take into consideration states seceding from the nation, we naturally take into consideration the Civil Battle. Within the 1860s, slaveholding states left the Union and shaped the Confederacy, and it led to the bloodiest battle in American historical past, leaving someplace between 620,000 and 750,000 troopers useless. So let’s simply say up prime that if California seceding led to a different battle, it could in all probability be over fairly rapidly.

Yeah. As a Californian, I do not suppose we’d be very efficient going up in opposition to the U.S. army.

That is Dr. Lee Ohanian, an economics professor at UCLA. And he would not have a lot confidence in California’s capacity to defeat the most effective funded army on the planet. Warfare appears loads completely different as we speak than it did within the 1860s. So if California have been to go away the nation, it could doubtlessly look extra like a divorce than a battle.

This might be a divorce. It could possibly be a really costly divorce. It is a tall order for a state to secede from the union. You understand, within the absence of making a battle, there must be some sort of negotiated settlement between the state of California and the remainder of the US. America would lose loads if California have been to turn into an unbiased entity. California is the fifth largest financial system on the planet, the house to almost 40 million folks. It is received some exceptional financial sectors, together with the tech sectors of Silicon Valley and San Francisco. It is dwelling to a number of leisure. You understand, it is an unlimited blockbuster financial system. So, , the remainder of the nation, from an financial viewpoint, wouldn’t wish to lose California.

It isn’t fully clear whether or not secession is even authorized. But when a state tried to secede, it might be slightly extra sophisticated than Steve Carell declaring chapter on The Workplace.

I declare chapter.

After the UK left the European Union within the notorious Brexit referendum in 2016 and following the election of Donald Trump later that very same yr, some Californians began pushing for a Calexit vote, a poll initiative that may pave the way in which for California to go away the US. However the U.S. shouldn’t be the European Union, and there is not any course of within the Structure for the way a state can depart.

Yeah, yeah. It is sophisticated. It isn’t as if “Hey, thanks. We’re out the door.”

This might be a breakup of the union. This might require an act of Congress.

That sounds fairly unlikely. Why on the planet with the opposite 49 states ever wish to quit the state with the fifth largest financial system on the planet? Properly, one situation might come all the way down to politics. Lets say a situation involving the 2024 election. And bear in mind, that is only a thought experiment, not a political prediction. Republicans win a congressional majority and the White Home, perhaps it is Donald Trump 2.0. Perhaps it is Ron DeSantis. Perhaps it is somebody we have by no means heard of. It would not matter. The vital factor right here is that Californians rapidly resolve they need out and the Republicans in management begin to suppose that concept sounds fairly good.

California’s simply very, very completely different. It is a very liberal state, has been for the final 20, 25 years. So there are some quarters that in all probability be considerably pleased to say, yeah, what, California can go off and past. It sounds okay with me.

California has extra electoral votes than some other state, 55, and it has probably the most congressional representatives, 53. 42 of that are Democrats. So in case you’re a Republican ready of energy, it turns into loads simpler to take care of that energy for an extended, very long time with out all these dependable Democratic votes in the way in which. In order a pure energy play, perhaps Calexit would not sound too unhealthy.

Yeah. You understand, from the standpoint of Republican president, that pesky fly that is at all times buzzing round your head. Yeah. Would not you’re keen on to have the ability to get it out the door and shut it?

So for the sake of argument, a Republican authorities is keen to assist California out the door for political causes. There are nonetheless a number of financial causes that they’d wish to negotiate pleasant phrases for the divorce.

So a number of divorces, there’s a number of worth misplaced. The 2 events would possibly really feel prefer it’s greatest to be aside, however once they each separate, they take stuff with them. The opposite ones get a large number. So the remainder of the 49 would wish to be sure that they nonetheless had entry to California items and companies, agricultural merchandise, to expertise. They might nonetheless wish to be sure that they needed to go to Disneyland or they needed to take a trip alongside the California coast. They might nonetheless do this with out having to cross the border and displaying your passport.

People are used to touring and Californians depend on tourism for a giant a part of their financial system and on a gentle inflow of different People to maneuver there for work. So that is one open border that even Republicans would possibly clamor for. Nobody desires to surrender Disneyland, and there are good causes to determine open commerce, too.

So a part of that divorce negotiated with the decide must be, hey, let’s attempt to make our future interactions from an financial viewpoint. Let’s attempt to make that so simple as doable. So the European Union is perhaps a mannequin for that. So inside the European Union, you possibly can cross borders. There’s primarily free commerce. So we’d anticipate to see one thing like that. That is what the opposite 49 actually would need. With 40 million folks, California’s a excessive earnings state. California’s the chief in expertise as we focus on well being can also be chief in agriculture. Folks usually name the valley in California America’s breadbasket due to the climate and the soil. A lot produce, a lot agricultural manufacturing takes place in California. So that you’re sitting in Nebraska and also you’re consuming a tomato and likelihood is that tomato got here from California or that head of lettuce got here from California.

Lots of people level out that with regards to federal taxes, California is a web donor. They pay extra into the U.S. tax base than they get again in comparison with smaller states like Wyoming, Alabama or Nebraska. So in the event that they left the U.S. Dr. Ohanian estimates that California might doubtlessly web $125 billion yearly, despite the fact that they might be giving up issues like Social Safety, Medicaid and different federal {dollars}. And there is a probability they’d must pay some kind of upfront value to go away as effectively. In any case, you’ve got received about 150 years of American funding in California. However let’s assume California desires out so badly that they are keen to pay any value. And our nice large nationwide divorce is finalized. Properly, as King George sings in Hamilton, that is the place issues begin to get actual.

You are by yourself. Superior. Wow. Do you could have a clue what occurs now?

The 2 greatest points that California would actually must confront could be forming a nationwide authorities. And that is no small activity.

No small activity is an understatement.

Creating your individual structure, making a nationwide, unbiased entity. In order that’s a giant job. It is also a giant job to tackle the duty of defending your folks from the standpoint of an unbiased nation. So out of the blue, California must create their very own militia.

The California Republic would wish a nationwide military. They want a brand new authorities and would wish to carry a brand new nationwide election. They’d perhaps desire a new nationwide flag. They want a brand new nationwide anthem. Goodbye to Francis Scott Key and maybe good day to Tupac Shakur.

California is aware of the best way to social gathering.

Yeah. That’d be my vote anyway. California would additionally have to construct a central financial institution, a treasury and a foreign money. They’d have to determine their very own embassies, treaties and commerce coverage.

So out of the blue, California could be confronted with the concept of, effectively, okay, there’s 179 international locations on the planet, together with the nation we simply left the US. Properly, we have to start out from scratch and work out how we will economically cope with all of those new entities. And that may be a frightening activity as effectively.

However Dr. Ohanian thinks that this can be one space the place being a separate nation might truly work out higher for Californians in the long term.

There’s some points of U.S. legal guidelines that in all probability aren’t working as effectively for California as California would really like. So one space is with worldwide commerce and worldwide financial relations. California is only a vibrant piece of the world financial system. So one can think about California partaking in rather more liberalized tariff and commerce negotiations with China, with Japan, with Singapore, with South Korea than what we have now in place proper now.

So I grew up in Connecticut and I really like my dwelling state, however they in all probability could not be a lot of a participant when it comes to world commerce. Few states can. However Dr. Ohanian thinks California is considered one of them.

We might additionally think about that immigration coverage might be not working all that effectively for California. You may make the case the immigration coverage, what we have now written in the US is 40 years previous. The immigration insurance policies we have now in place are very a lot nation quota based mostly. So we take so many from Nation A, any person from Nation B, California would like to see rather more liberalized immigration legal guidelines.

A lot of California’s greatest firms have been based by immigrants. If the US will not replace its immigration insurance policies, perhaps an unbiased California republic might.

About half, the truth is, much more than half of all profitable tech startups are from immigrants. And these are remarkably proficient, artistic, tremendous clever, extremely expert folks from all around the world. And U.S. legislation makes extremely troublesome for these folks to remain right here. To the extent that California is the chief, you would possibly make the case on the planet for top expertise with Silicon Valley and San Francisco, all of the enterprise capital that funds these startups. A lot of the enterprise capital world is in California. And you can think about California would simply love to have the ability to carry within the subsequent Elon Musk. The subsequent Sergey Brin actually liberalize immigration legal guidelines.

However you can additionally think about a situation the place Elon Musk threatens to go away an unbiased California over points like increased taxes or left leaning politics. Really, you do not even must think about that one. It is what Musk is doing proper now.

Sure, I’ve moved to Texas. So California’s been profitable for a very long time. And I believe they’re taking it with no consideration.

And that may be the place issues turn into extra sophisticated for California. California’s politics have moved additional to the left than most of America’s prior to now few a long time, and balancing social beliefs like, for instance, common well being care or stronger local weather insurance policies, whereas additionally sustaining a pleasant enterprise setting, could possibly be as powerful of a street for an unbiased California because it presently is for the US.

California is a excessive tax, excessive regulation state. To be sincere, California is the primary state to start out a enterprise that’s usually ranked by CEOs because the worst place within the nation to do enterprise. So there’s a number of concern, there’s a number of frustration, there’s a number of disappointment. And that in the end falls on the backs of who’s accountable for politics.

In the meantime, with out the reliably liberal votes of California, it isn’t laborious to think about the remainder of the US shifting additional to the proper, doubling down on enterprise pleasant concepts, but in addition passing nationwide abortion bans or reversing clear vitality insurance policies which might speed up local weather change even for Californians. Which begs the query, would secession even be value it?

And so ultimately, we have now to do that as a result of there is not any different manner.

For us, California seceding could also be a enjoyable thought experiment. However for Sean Forbes, it is a calling. He is the president of the California Nationwide Get together. They’re urging a California secession for 2 causes. They do not suppose California will get sufficient again from the remainder of the US.

I do not suppose truly our energy is appreciated sufficient or truly utilized effectively.

And he thinks an unbiased California would higher reside as much as American values than the remainder of the US is doing proper now.

I am taking a look at it as one thing the place we have now to in an effort to maintain our values as a result of the remainder of the nation is semi-okay with going right into a darker course. I believe the 4 years of the trump administration has actually already proven a disaster and that many individuals all through the US are okay with that disaster. I imply, we have had main points which have actually form of value us any form of sense that the nation goes a optimistic course or can change in the direction of a optimistic course. And that is our relationship with a number of these crimson states.

He envisions a Calexit just like the peaceable divorce that Dr. Ohanian outlined above. And he thinks that an unbiased California might supply an instance of higher authorities to the America that they depart behind. He thinks a system extra just like a European Parliament with proportional illustration would work extra successfully. And he argues, it could be higher for Californians to even California Republicans.

California going unbiased permits an opportunity to wipe the slate clear with regards to a number of the constitutional frameworks. So once more, we are able to have proportional illustration the place smaller events have a say in California authorities, which they do not know. If we wipe the slate clear, we have now completely different events are available in, they must do coalitions. They’ve to truly work collectively, provide you with higher concepts.

After the break, we’ll look at the philosophy and the legality behind the secession motion and listen to from one knowledgeable who footage a a lot darker situation if California have been to go away.

Welcome again to Draw back Up. I am Chris Cillizza. And as we speak we’re imagining a world the place California has succeeded from the US. I am notably interested by what’s pushed all this secession speak of late. Dr. Lee Ohanian, an economist at UCLA, thinks it could be the identical set of forces that has led to a lot dysfunction in nationwide politics.

I believe it in all probability may be traced again to a set of voters who suppose, what, life’s form of passing me by. Politicians aren’t listening to me. Globalization shouldn’t be working for me so effectively. My dad or mine was working in an auto plant or metal manufacturing facility and making an incredible dwelling and had an incredible pension. And and now I can not get a $50 an hour job in that Ford manufacturing facility, it is $18 an hour. Persons are saying, I desire a completely different lifestyle. I do not see eye to eye with you. And I do not see you doing a adequate job for me and I wish to hearth you. We noticed that in 2016 when Trump shocked everyone getting elected. We nonetheless see that happening. We nonetheless see a rustic that is being pushed additional out to the sides.

There is a rising discontent in American politics at virtually each degree, and which may be driving the dialog about secession, whether or not it is in California, Texas or anyplace in between.

You would possibly suppose it is farfetched for California to secede, however the pot is effervescent.

However there could also be one thing deeper right here, too. In some methods, the philosophy behind secession could also be baked into the very DNA of the US. Richard Kreitner is the writer of “Break It Up,” a e-book that charts the historical past of secession actions in America. And he believes this want to interrupt up has at all times been there.

When was America ever actually united? There’s actually no second in American political historical past the place you possibly can look and say, yep, that that was the second we have been all collectively. And I believe it does return to, , our political DNA or the very starting of white colonial settlement within the Americas. The pilgrims weren’t known as pilgrims of their day. They have been known as separatists as a result of they needed to separate or secede from the Church of England and set up their very own church buildings. And that was unlawful, and that was why they left. So America, in that sense, is based on the very, very starting by separatists. After which, in fact, the American Revolution, the founding occasion of our nation, is an act of secession from the British Empire.

We love this story of People coming collectively to defeat the British Empire and type their very own nation. However they did this out of necessity and a typical enemy. The 13 colonies truly did not have that a lot in frequent, says Kreitner.

They did not wish to have something to do with each other. The entire concept of coming to America was to be disunited and divided, and it was solely very reluctantly that they joined collectively in what some thought a brief alliance to struggle in opposition to the British Empire and the creation of the nation in that sense was form of a way to the tip of profitable independence and never an finish in itself. And lots of people had doubts in regards to the total enterprise proper from the start.

Even our nation’s identify, the US of America, hints at a way that our union is extra compelled than it’s pure.

Lots of people do not take into consideration, , what a bizarre identify that’s for a rustic. However the precise identify was crafted by a man named John Dickinson, who was tasked with drawing up the primary American Structure, the Articles of Confederation. It is a declare that that which has not been united heretofore goes to be united from right here on out, and that in time, the nation will turn into the proof that this identify was truly correct in a manner that when it was given, it was not. However what’s attention-grabbing about Dickinson is that he is the one man who voted in opposition to the Declaration of Independence on the Continental Congress. And the rationale why he voted in opposition to it was as a result of he thought the nation was not united sufficient.

He additionally coined the slogan a number of years earlier, United We Stand, Divided We Fall, which was this nice revolutionary tune. However when he was trying round in 1776, he noticed all these conflicts over land, over taxes, over illustration, over slavery. And he thought that the nation, if it declared independence from Britain earlier than deciding on a structure, earlier than forming a union collectively, would collapse into some form of vicious civil battle. So he voted in opposition to the Declaration of Independence, despite the fact that on the similar time form of leaving the Continental Congress in Philadelphia in a huff he dropped on their desk. The primary draft of the Articles of Confederation, which begins the identify of this nation, shall be the US of America. So this sense of like this unity is embedded proper there within the very identify that we, , so blithely discuss, , Joe Biden very solemnly. We’re the US of America.

We’re the US of America. There’s not a single factor we can not do if we do it collectively.

Behind that, beneath that’s this complete story of disunity. Proper from the very starting.

Kreitner believes that unity has at all times been extra aspirational than lifelike. Perhaps it is simply the legislation of entropy, however the US has at all times been on the verge of breaking apart. Everyone knows the massive one. In 1861, following the election of Abraham Lincoln, the South seceded to protect slavery, resulting in a 4 yr civil battle. However do you know that earlier than the Civil Battle, elements of the North truly needed to go away the nation.

For the longest time till 1860, 1861, The Affiliation of Disunionism in American Politics was with the North, not with the South, as a result of there have been these Northern abolitionists who have been going round very loudly calling for a disunion of the nation.

Just like Sean Forbes and the California Nationwide Get together’s argument for an unbiased California. Abolitionists thought one of the best ways to protect their American beliefs was to go away America. However after the battle, the nation spent a long time hoping to keep away from a battle like that one ever once more.

The Civil Battle was an enormous nationwide trauma, after which we form of repressed the reason for the dispute, which was slavery. However it was additionally this query of secession. How united are we, actually? And no person needed to run the danger of one other civil battle, which is how you could have reconstruction come to an finish, as a result of the North says we’re not going to ship troops as soon as once more to implement the Structure and majority rule within the South.

Kreitner believes that the last decade following the Civil Battle, a interval often called reconstruction, might need been our greatest second to actually turn into a United States of America and embrace a multiracial democracy throughout the nation. As a substitute, to keep away from additional battle, the North capitulated to Southern calls for, and the nation additionally argued that secession was unlawful.

The U.S. Structure doesn’t have a provision for secession. There’s a Supreme Court docket ruling which lots of people will form of trumpet or trot on the market from 1869, Texas, V White wherein the Supreme Court docket mentioned, no, you possibly can’t succeed. The Accomplice authorities of Texas was not a reputable establishment. You’ll be able to’t secede from the US. However that is solely backed by the power of union arms. You understand, the union received the battle, and that is why secession is against the law in the US or was deemed unlawful in the US.

In different phrases, secession was unlawful as a result of the union defeated the secessionists. If the South had received the battle, then secession would very clearly have been authorized. And if California determined to check the waters as we speak, we might must see what occurs. It is value noting that California’s state structure declares it a, quote, inseparable half and quote of the US. Secession efforts just like the California Nationwide Get together are hoping for would require a change to the state structure, in addition to a number of different powerful hoops to leap by means of. However Kreitner would not suppose that the unique colonies would have ever created the US in the event that they thought they’d be caught in it completely.

Say what you’ll about them. And I might say loads. The Confederates form of had a degree in regards to the legality of secession. I believe that the states that joined the Union in 1788, they ratified the Structure. Not a single one would have if the idea was you possibly can by no means depart. You understand, you are becoming a member of this structure, you possibly can by no means depart.

In truth, a number of the nation’s founders assumed that California would finally be its personal nation in some mixture with Oregon and Washington state.

You understand, California plus Oregon plus Washington has at all times been one thing that is been bandied about even again to the 1840s, , earlier than California joined the union. There’s this concept that the Pacific Coast could be its personal separate republic. Thomas Jefferson supported that. Daniel Webster supported that. Lots of people thought that it was simply too far and too completely different from the remainder of the US. And there needs to be this separate Pacific Republic populated by People allied with the US, however unbiased from it. And that concept has continued, in fact, by means of the twentieth century.

That is a situation that he believes would work higher than only a separate California, as a result of California is not rather more united than the US. Los Angeles could be very completely different from the Inland Empire or San Diego. The O.C. has little or no in frequent with farm fields of the Central Valley. San Francisco is completely different from Eureka, which is completely different from Sacramento. Lately, the city and rural divide is extra pronounced in America than the state divides, argues Kreitner.

Definitely the divide in American politics as we speak is rather more city versus rural than state by state. You understand what state any person lives in would not inform you a complete lot about which manner they are going to vote. One thing like 46% of Texans voted for Joe Biden within the presidential election. So it isn’t even like small minorities in any respect. And that is true in California. I noticed one thing not too long ago that the state with probably the most Trump voters by quantity is California.

That is proper. By way of pure numbers, there have been extra Trump voters in California than in some other state within the nation. That is one thing an unbiased California must account for. And it is why Kreitner thinks an actual California secession motion could be loads messier than the amicable divorce described by Dr. Lee Ohanian and Sean Forbes.

I do suppose that if it have been to occur, it could not appear to be Scotland’s referendum on independence and even Brexit, the place it is only a peace time referendum, the place the negotiations are opened, which might be what the California separatists that you simply’re speaking to are imagining. I believe it is more likely that California’s secession or some other state secession is the consequence of some form of huge political disaster in the US reasonably than the reason for it. You understand, it will be a response to a disputed presidential election or to pretenders to the presidency, one thing like that, the place every thing is form of falling aside and states resolve to choose up the items and reconstitute political authority at a extra native degree.

The spike in secession speak is an indication that People are annoyed with their present political actuality virtually at each degree. However it’s additionally a menace that is been there for a very long time.

I imply, all all through American historical past, you could have folks enjoying either side. You understand, it is like as we speak the place Californians, after the 2016 election, Trump is elected, are desirous about sucession and saying we needs to be our personal unbiased nation. After which Biden wins and you’ve got Texas speaking about it. And all of the liberals are like, No, you possibly can’t do this. That is treasonous.

He is proper. Lately, you are extra prone to hear Senator Ted Cruz speaking about Texit than to listen to about an actual Calexit motion. Cruz says he wasn’t there but, but-

And if there comes a degree. The place it is hopeless, then I believe we take NASA, we take the army, we take the oil.

And that is the factor. Secession has at all times been a really efficient menace for states to get what they need.

It is this type of prepared handy answer to any intractable political and even social dispute and even financial or non secular dispute again within the day. You understand, in case you’re sad with the way in which issues are going, you can simply decide up and transfer on that intuition, as in peanuts, , take the ball and go dwelling, it is form of a quite common one in American politics.

California has a number of political energy today. Vice President Kamala Harris is a Californian. The speaker of the Home, Nancy Pelosi, and the highest Republican within the Home, Kevin McCarthy, are additionally Californians. With out California, Richard Nixon and Ronald Reagan would have by no means reached the White Home. States like Texas and California have a number of sway over the course of the US, even once they’re annoyed and reasonably than taking their ball and going dwelling. The tougher work could also be forcing the US to reside as much as its identify and to its promise and to truly be united.

Whenever you look over the course of American historical past, we have by no means actually been united as a result of even on the moments the place you suppose that we’re, similar to within the post-World Battle II period, you continue to have racial apartheid in the US. You understand, there have at all times been folks omitted from no matter claims to unity there have even been within the first place presently the place we’re lastly making an attempt to make good on the guarantees of reconstruction, the founding beliefs in a manner that is truly by no means been achieved earlier than. We’re both going to go someway manner, or they are going to do this and attain that, consummate that, you would possibly say, or we’re not. And if we do not, the one different possibility is both, one can break up, , we are able to dissolve into constituent elements of 1 type or one other, or you are going to have some form of totalitarianism over all the nation. And appears to me that of these two choices, a dissolution, a breakup is the superior possibility. I nonetheless hope we keep away from it. I nonetheless hope that we go down the trail of multiracial democracy and ending the work of reconstruction.

So whereas it is enjoyable to daydream about what an unbiased California or an unbiased Texas would possibly appear to be, the fact of attending to that time might create a complete host of latest issues. And if the expression of succession is actually the effervescent up with frustrations about how America works as we speak, we might wish to attempt reforming this nation earlier than we begin to reform a bunch of latest international locations.

And now it is time for Richard Kreitner to hitch me for slightly trivia about California and secession. Okay. Query one. After European colonization, California has been part of what, three nations? What three nations has California been part of?

After European colonization that may be Spain, Mexico and the US, though there was a 3 week interval the place it was its personal nation, , in accordance with some.

Increase, eat that trivia folks. He received that plus further credit score. Query quantity two, despite the fact that you actually aced query primary. So I am optimistic. California was the thirty first state admitted to the union. It joined in 1850. Title both the thirtieth state or the thirty second state. Would you like a touch?

No.

Find it irresistible. No trace. That is my form of man.

What, Texas? Can be the- the thirtieth?

No. However you continue to can identify the 30- I am providing you with two guesses as a result of there’s two states, thirtieth or the thirty second. I am providing you with your trace. Each states are within the Midwest.

Perhaps Kansas could be the thirty second.

Oh, wow.

The larger trace was the thirty second was the unique dwelling for the Los Angeles Lakers. Would you could have gotten it if I gave you that?

That’d be Minnesota.

I might have gotten that.

Yeah, that is what I figured. I solely gave you half of the trace. Okay, query three. In the event you get this one, I’ll be extraordinarily impressed. In San Francisco in 1859 this man proclaimed himself emperor of the US and later known as himself protector of Mexico. Mark Twain based mostly the character of the King within the Adventures of Huckleberry Finn off of him, identify that man.

I do not know.

I am gonna write that down.

Joshua Norton was born in England. Grew up in South Africa and by some means made his method to San Francisco within the late 1840s. In 1859, he declared himself Emperor of the US, and for the remainder of his life was handled with one thing like bemused kindness by the folks of San Francisco. Even created his personal foreign money that some locations on the town truly accepted. When he died in 1880, 10,000 folks turned up for his funeral. Right now, it is one thing of a people hero, and there are nonetheless efforts to get the Bay Bridge named after him. Okay, right here we go. We’re going from the chic to the ridiculous. Query 4: on this in style post-apocalyptic online game collection, the U.S. has collapsed in a brand new republic of California has emerged. They actually have a new flag with a mutant two headed bear. Title the collection, which refers back to the aftermath of nuclear battle.

Would that be Fallout?

Sure, it could be Fallout. I’ve heard. Approach to present your breadth of information. Okay, final one. Query quantity 5. California has extra nationwide parks than some other state within the nation. What number of are there? And I’ll say inside 5. What number of are there inside 5 extra nationwide parks than some other state within the nation.

18.

9. Which if we do 5. You got here shut, however not proper. For these of you enjoying alongside at dwelling, the 9 parks are Joshua Tree, Sequoia & Kings Canyon, Redwood, Lassen Volcanic, Level Reyes, Channel Islands, Dying Valley, Pinnacles and sure, Yosemite. Thanks to Richard Kramer for becoming a member of us for trivia this week. Two out of 5 is not that unhealthy. And these have been a number of the hardest trivia questions we have had to this point. Hopefully, Richard is not going to take his ball and go dwelling now.

So what would a world appear to be if California seceded? Properly, if we placed on our rose coloured glasses and picture the most effective case situation, we undergo a considerably peaceable divorce, leaving a really liberal California, a really conservative United States, and open commerce and journey between the 2. But when we take a look at the darkest timeline, effectively, perhaps different states begin to secede, too, and all the American experiment collapses. Enjoyable occasions. Thanks to Dr. Leo Ohanian, Sean Forbes and Richard Kreitner for becoming a member of us in our large thought experiment as we speak. Let me know your ideas on whether or not California ought to depart the U.S. by tweeting me at Chris C-I-L-L-I-Z-Z-A. And in case you’ve received concepts for future subjects, please ship these to me too. Additionally, in case you like our present, share it with your mates and ensure you fee assessment and subscribe.

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The group from Pod Folks consists of Rachael King, Matt Sav, Aimee Machado, John Hammontree, Madison Lusby, Regina de Heer, and Morgan Fouse.

Theme and authentic music composed by Casey Holford. Further music got here from epidemic sound.

Particular because of Lindsay Abrams, Fuzz Hogan, Drew Shankman, Lisa Namerow, John Dianora, Katie Hinman, Robert Mathers, and Sarina Singh.