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‘Modern Love’ Podcast: Hank Azaria’s Advice for Overcoming Codependency

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‘Modern Love’ Podcast: Hank Azaria’s Advice for Overcoming Codependency

Hank Azaria is used to putting on other personalities. You probably know him best from his work as a voice actor on “The Simpsons,” where he plays Moe the bartender, Professor Frink, Chief Wiggum and Snake Jailbird, among many others. His list of credits in stage plays, movies and TV shows is prolific, including roles like his Tony-nominated performance in “Spamalot,” Phoebe’s boyfriend on “Friends” and the dog walker on “Mad About You.” But at a certain point in his life, Azaria realized that he was using humor and acting to be anyone but himself, and that it was affecting his real-life relationships. After five devastating heartbreaks, he resolved to look inward, address his codependency issues and become his most authentic self.

In this episode, Azaria tells us how he found authenticity and reads the Modern Love essay “In Defense of My Emu Tattoo,” about an author who masks his true self by using humor but eventually finds love by learning to be himself.

How to submit a Modern Love Essay to The New York Times

How to submit a Tiny Love Story

Unlock full access to New York Times podcasts and explore everything from politics to pop culture. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify.

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Links to transcripts of episodes generally appear on these pages within a week.


Modern Love is hosted by Anna Martin and produced by Reva Goldberg, Emily Lang, Davis Land and Amy Pearl. The show is edited by Jen Poyant, our executive producer. Production management is by Christina Djossa. The show is mixed by Sophia Lanman and recorded by Maddy Masiello and Nick Pitman. It features original music by Pat McCusker, Dan Powell, Aman Sahota, Rowan Niemisto and Diane Wong. Our theme music is by Dan Powell.

Special thanks to Larissa Anderson, Dahlia Haddad, Lisa Tobin, Brooke Minters, Daniel Jones, Miya Lee, Mahima Chablani, Nell Gallogly, Jeffrey Miranda, Isabella Anderson, Christine Nguyen, Reyna Desai, Jordan Cohen, Victoria Kim, Nina Lassam and Julia Simon.

Thoughts? Email us at modernlovepodcast@nytimes.com.

Want more from Modern Love? Read past stories. Watch the TV series and sign up for the newsletter. We also have swag at the NYT Store and two books, “Modern Love: True Stories of Love, Loss and Redemption” and “Tiny Love Stories: True Tales of Love in 100 Words or Less.”

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SNL's 50th season proved it's still relevant. Can it stay that way?

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SNL's 50th season proved it's still relevant. Can it stay that way?

On Saturday Night Live’s cold open, James Austin Johnson played President Donald Trump and Emil Wakim played Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman in a sketch about Trump’s Middle East trip.

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Will Heath/NBC

After watching a storied comedy brand finish one of its most creatively successful seasons in recent memory, I couldn’t help but think of a pressing question:

What’s next for Saturday Night Live?

No matter how well things go on a given episode or in a given season, it isn’t long before that question re-emerges — especially given how eager some in the entertainment press have always been to pen the show’s eulogy. In a way, it’s the biggest drawback for a show that boasts the potential of reinventing itself every week.

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Ironically, Saturday’s episode didn’t give many hints about the ultimate answer, despite capping SNL’s highly-hyped 50th anniversary season.

Even though Weekend Update co-host Colin Jost’s wife Scarlett Johansson hosted this year’s season finale – boosting rumors that he and onscreen partner Michael Che might announce their departure then – they didn’t, and everything unfolded in a typical fashion featuring a star who has become a regular, game contributor. (Though Jost did hand his wife a bouquet of red roses during the final goodbye segment.)

The numbers, provided by NBC, tell a story of success: they say SNL will finish its season as the top broadcast entertainment program among viewers aged 18 to 49. (That’s a relatively youthful and ad-friendly group for TV watchers.) The network also says this season has averaged 8.2 million viewers each week across all platforms.

So, as much as some critics may still want to shade the show, SNL remains one of the most powerful brands in comedy. But following up the hype of its 50th anniversary next season may be its biggest remaining challenge.

Here’s where I think SNL stands – and questions that remain – as it wraps up one of its most successful seasons in recent memory.

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What happens to Weekend Update if Jost and Che both depart after this season?

The biggest parlor game among SNL fans at the end of a season is playing “who’s leaving the cast this year?” Johansson even joked in her musical monologue that castmember Sarah Sherman was leaving, to Sherman’s mock astonishment. And the biggest rumor before Saturday’s broadcast was that Weekend Update hosts and veteran writers Jost and Che might be out the door after cementing their status as the longest-running anchors of SNL’s newscast parody.

Colin Jost and Michael Che during Weekend Update in December.

Colin Jost and Michael Che during Weekend Update in December.

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In recent years, Update has emerged as the most reliable segment in an often-uneven show, as Che and Jost honed their oddball chemistry as an uncaring provocateur paired with a snarky guy willing to parody his own privilege. Assuming they might still leave, let me breeze past obvious successor suggestions — like castmember and frequent Update contributor Michael Longfellow — to provide a suggestion from left field: Josh Johnson, the prolific standup comic and Daily Show correspondent. It’s true that Johnson, who has built a growing fanbase with a long string of immensely popular YouTube videos, already seems to be developing a career on his own terms. But taking the reins of a comedy institution like Update could boost his work to a new level while pointing the way toward SNL’s future.

SNL made news this year beyond its comedy.

Who knew an SNL bit could spark real-life gossip about one of TV’s biggest hits? After Sherman parodied The White Lotus star Aimee Lou Wood in the sketch dubbed “The White Potus,” Wood called the portrayal “mean and unfunny” on social media and loads of coverage followed. (It didn’t help that Wood’s Lotus co-star Walton Goggins initially complimented the sketch on SNL’s Instagram page, fueling rumors of a rift between the two.)

Sarah Sherman during "The White Potus" sketch on April 12, 2025.

Sarah Sherman during “The White Potus” sketch on April 12, 2025.

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And, in a separate controversy, a bit Ego Nwodim led playing a hacky standup comic during an Update segment prompted the audience to shout out a curse word in unison, unplanned. Nwodim says she eventually talked to executive producer Lorne Michaels to see if the show was going to be fined — and in a bit during Saturday’s Update playing that character again, she was a little more careful about what cues she gave the audience. But that earlier bit also produced one of the most talked-about moments of the season. Proof that SNL can still make news even when the subject isn’t its landmark anniversary.

Speculation about when or whether Lorne Michaels will leave the show now seems beside the point.

At age 80, Michaels seems like the Highlander of network television – an enduring force, forever the show’s wise and steady hand, guiding events from behind-the-scenes. However he has divided authority among his lieutenants, things seem to be working – the show produced a string of consistently good episodes in 2025, particularly in programs featuring guests hosts Jack Black and Jon Hamm. Those successes, combined with the reputation-boosting triumph of the 50th anniversary celebrations, should be enough to quiet the “when is Lorne retiring?” rumors for at least another season. (As I have said before, when the inevitable retirement does happen, if the show doesn’t end, I think Seth Meyers would be an awesome successor, or perhaps Jost.)

Despite a Kamala Harris cameo, SNL hasn’t quite figured out a consistently groundbreaking way to lampoon modern politics. But that’s okay.

It feels like a lifetime ago when then-Vice President Harris sat across from Maya Rudolph in a sketch airing just before November’s presidential election. That was also the episode that gave us a cavalcade of celebrity guest stars playing political figures, including Dana Carvey as then-President Joe Biden, Andy Samberg as Harris’ hubby Doug Emhoff and Jim Gaffigan as Harris’ running mate Tim Walz.

Maya Rudolph and then-Vice President Kamala Harris during the cold open on November 2, 2024.

Maya Rudolph and then-Vice President Kamala Harris during the cold open on November 2, 2024.

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But too few of those big comedic swings seemed to hit their mark this season. Amid the shock of keeping up with the second Trump administration, SNL only intermittently captured the chaos of the times. Even the political sketches centered on James Austin Johnson’s impeccable impression of the president sometimes could feel like a transcript of the real-life POTUS’ scattershot musings — especially in Saturday’s “cold open” sketch, which satirized President Trump’s Middle East trip a day after the real-life POTUS flew back from it. (“The White Potus” sketch, its Wood impression notwithstanding, was a brilliant step up.) The lesson here: perhaps it’s time to stop expecting SNL to nail the political moment every week and give them space to find new angles.

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In a world where comedy brands are increasingly built on podcasts and social media videos, SNL still matters.

As late night TV erodes in other timeslots and younger viewers desert traditional television platforms, SNL faced a season where it had to argue for its relevance while also paying tribute to an astonishing comedy legacy. (The nitpicker in me is compelled to note that SNL’s 50th anniversary technically isn’t until later this year; the show debuted on Oct. 11, 1975.) But the massive celebration surrounding its 50th anniversary season, which started last September, elevated SNL by reminding audiences what a cultural institution it truly is.

Indeed, the show’s history was too big to fit into one special, with its three-and-a-half hour prime time extravaganza in February preceded by a commemorative concert, Questlove’s brilliant documentary on the show’s musical history and a four-part docuseries on Peacock. The giant-size celebration served as a potent reminder that, frustrating as SNL’s inconsistencies can be week-to-week, there is no other program like it on American television – a live showcase for the best TV comedy featuring top performers reacting to pop culture and politics very nearly in real time.

Small wonder there’s a six-episode version of SNL planned for British TV next year.

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Justin and Hailey Bieber Go to Toronto Maple Leafs Playoff Game

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Justin and Hailey Bieber Go to Toronto Maple Leafs Playoff Game

Justin & Hailey Bieber
Cheesing At NHL Playoff Game

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Austria wins 69th Eurovision Song Contest

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Austria wins 69th Eurovision Song Contest

JJ, winner of the 2025 Eurovision Song Contest, holds up the trophy he won for Austria with the song “Wasted Love” during the Grand Final of the 69th Eurovision Song Contest, in Basel, Switzerland, Saturday, May 17, 2025.

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Austria has won the 69th Eurovision Song Contest. “Wasted Love,” performed by the classically trained JJ, beat out 25 other songs for the top prize at the finals held in Basel, Switzerland, on Saturday.

“Wasted Love” is in some ways similar to last year’s winner — Nemo’s “The Code” — in that it includes soaring, operatic vocals. But while the 2024 victor was more club anthem than aria, “Wasted Love” is the opposite. Banging beats only appear in the final part of the song. Nemo was 24 when they won Eurovision last year. This year’s winner shares the same age.

JJ co-wrote the winning song with Teodora Spiric and Thomas Turner.

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This the third time Austria has won the international singing competition. Udo Jürgens claimed the top prize in 1965 and Conchita Wurst in 2014.

Israel took second place and Estonia came in third.

JJ called for “more love” in his message while accepting the trophy.

As is customary, the 70th Eurovision Song Contest will be held in Austria.

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